Raven Concealment Kydex Holsters

[MilanWG]

SWEET! Very nice - wish I kept my order

ps. No dump pouch?

[ShadowNet]

Sweet set-up Brian, looks super slick.

btw, do CAPS shooters use dump pouches, or do they just let their mags drop to the ground? I broke a hi-capa mag base plate dropping it to the floor....

[MilanWG]

Personally, I have been using a dump pouch since day one when I started CAPS.

I don't like dropping my mags = broken and leaky mags.

Most IPSC guys tend to drop their mags (we use rubber mats to "soften" the blow of the mags hitting the deck).

But CAPS is moving more towards tactical-type shooting like IDPA - where retaining your mags can be mandatory.

A dump pouch is highly recommend (my 2cents).

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by TALIBANMILAN

SWEET! Very nice - wish I kept my order

ps. No dump pouch?

I have one, but haven't figured out where I'd put it yet, as I typically run with a Fastmag carrier right behind the pistol mag pouch, and I don't like wearing my dump pouch on the front like a kangaroo. I suppose I could have it right at the rear...

In any case, I don't really use dump pouches. If my mag is empty, then technically, there's no real point in retaining a spent mag in the middle of combat as it's "useless" at that moment. I'd rather do a fast reload rather than do a retention reload.

For retention reloads, I'm shoving the partial mag in to a pant pocket or in to an empty mag pouch for later use.

Originally Posted by ShadowNet

btw, do CAPS shooters use dump pouches, or do they just let their mags drop to the ground? I broke a hi-capa mag base plate dropping it to the floor....

Some CAPS shooters use dump pouches. Some don't.

Hi-Capa mags and Glock mags are notorious for breaking on impact. It's why companies (like ILLusion Kinetics) make reinforced metal plates. I've been running metal plates on most of my Hi-Capas since day one and haven't had a problem with breaks or leaks yet.

[ShadowNet]

Ah I see. What belt is that on your rig btw?

[ILLusion]

I use 5 different belts for different setups/pants/whatever, but the one in that specific photo set is just a Condor rigger's belt.

My favorite rigger's belt is still the CQB Solutions product.

Ideally, I'd rather have everything mounted to a 1.5" inner/outer duty belt setup, as it's easier to don and doff without ever having to move the location of the holsters, but it's hard to mount holsters like this on to stiff duty belts. I find that it adds a lot of stress that the holster just isn't designed for.

[ShadowNet]

Just received my holster from JT today. Quality is superb. I have yet to try out the molle clips, but will do so when by battle belt arrives. Only issue I have is that the fit is super tight. And by super tight, I mean, I gave myself a cataclysmic wedgie when I didn't draw my pistol fast enough. Also, if I don't put my thumb on the back of my Glock's slide, holstering it would cause the slide to come out of battery. I'll prolly need to "wear-in" the holster has ILLusion suggested. It wears the finish of the slide and frame - but that's a given.

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by ShadowNet

Also, if I don't put my thumb on the back of my Glock's slide, holstering it would cause the slide to come out of battery.

This is normal with ANY holster and ANY gun. It should be a standard practice to holster with your thumb depressing the back of the slide.

From the looks of your setup, the fit around the trigger guard looks extremely aggressive, which could be the cause for the amount of tension you're getting. For non-light setups, the trigger guard is typically the contact point for retention.

[ShadowNet]

Originally Posted by ILLusion

This is normal with ANY holster and ANY gun. It should be a standard practice to holster with your thumb depressing the back of the slide.

From the looks of your setup, the fit around the trigger guard looks extremely aggressive, which could be the cause for the amount of tension you're getting. For non-light setups, the trigger guard is typically the contact point for retention.

Ah, I see. There is a lot more wear on my trigger guard and the front/upper part of my slide. Where is the contact point for guns with lights?

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by ShadowNet

Ah, I see. There is a lot more wear on my trigger guard and the front/upper part of my slide. Where is the contact point for guns with lights?

Retention is at the forward edge of the ejection port, and along features of the light itself. Depends on the light.

[NVC]

Originally Posted by ShadowNet

Just received my holster from JT today. Quality is superb. I have yet to try out the molle clips, but will do so when by battle belt arrives. Only issue I have is that the fit is super tight. And by super tight, I mean, I gave myself a cataclysmic wedgie when I didn't draw my pistol fast enough. Also, if I don't put my thumb on the back of my Glock's slide, holstering it would cause the slide to come out of battery. I'll prolly need to "wear-in" the holster has ILLusion suggested. It wears the finish of the slide and frame - but that's a given.

Your cataclysmic wedgie issue is that the TM glock frame is wider that the real steel mold that was used to make your holster. Or the mold is too tight. That is why your holster is extremely tight and will create massive wear on your slide and very poor draw. Extreme case is that the gun gets stuck or locked in the holster and you have to hulk it out. Your draw should be silky smooth and fast while still having the "clicking" lock sound while reholstering your pistol. Improper formed holsters you will lose the balance of fast draw and retention features that kydex offers.

Depending on the thickness of the kydex used wear-in will not change your retention problems unless you reheat it. Also if your slide is racking while you insert your pistol into the holster is another sign of improper molding and retention. In the forming phase they missed a step. You should not have to use your thumb to press on the back of the slide when reholstering your pistol, this is another sign of a improper molding and retention. This can lead to double feeds and slide battery issue's and cause fail to fire when you need it the most.

[ILLusion]

I agree, re-heating it will be the best option, looking at how tight the trigger guard appears.

Originally Posted by NVC

Also if your slide is racking while you insert your pistol into the holster is another sign of improper molding and retention. In the forming phase they missed a step. You should not have to use your thumb to press on the back of the slide when reholstering your pistol, this is another sign of a improper molding and retention. This can lead to double feeds and slide battery issue's and cause fail to fire when you need it the most.

Please fire off an email to Blackhawk, Eagle Industries, Safariland, and Blade-Tech and tell all of them this, because every holster I've tried from these companies have the potential to cause this problem, fitted Kydex or not.

[NVC]

I too have owned many real steal holsters brands from Blackhawk, Sarfariland, Blade tech, Fobus, Uncle Mikes and canceled my order from Raven. Every holster design has its pro's and cons. The main issue is some airsoft pistols are off spec with wider slides and are used in real steel dimension holsters which cause's the out of battery issue with the slide. Airsoft pistols have very soft recoil springs compared real steel in which are more prone to rack the slide in tight form fitted kydex holsters when re-holstering. So I would have to correct myself so say its not incorrect molding and retention because its was design for real steel pistols not airsoft pistols.

I was proactive and instead of sending email on deaf ears. I decided make my own holster for all my airsoft pistols with weaponlights in my collection. They incorporates all the features that I like and which also remedies/fix's issue's that I had experience with other holsters in the past.

Shadownet the only way you can fix your holster retention is by re-heating it with a heat gun. On your pictures I can see shiny spots on the kydex. That is a sign that the kydex has been overheated and is too hot. So take care and don't spot heat in one place too long and keep it moving. Also don't heat areas that you dont need or you will lose the shape/form of you holster. Also use a proper ridge duty with these type of kydex form fitted holsters which will help with the holster being pulled up during your draw and also prevent the holster from swaying side to side. Another tip is when you weave you belt through the holster also weave it through the belt loop of your pants in the middle of the two belt loops of the holster. If you dont understand I can post a pic for you.

[ShadowNet]

Originally Posted by NVC

Your cataclysmic wedgie issue is that the TM glock frame is wider that the real steel mold that was used to make your holster. Or the mold is too tight. That is why your holster is extremely tight and will create massive wear on your slide and very poor draw. Extreme case is that the gun gets stuck or locked in the holster and you have to hulk it out. Your draw should be silky smooth and fast while still having the "clicking" lock sound while reholstering your pistol. Improper formed holsters you will lose the balance of fast draw and retention features that kydex offers.


Depending on the thickness of the kydex used wear-in will not change your retention problems unless you reheat it. Also if your slide is racking while you insert your pistol into the holster is another sign of improper molding and retention. In the forming phase they missed a step. You should not have to use your thumb to press on the back of the slide when reholstering your pistol, this is another sign of a improper molding and retention. This can lead to double feeds and slide battery issue's and cause fail to fire when you need it the most.

The cataclysmic wedgie was actually due to bad belt adjustment. My Glock, as you can tell from the photos, has a Guarder frame - so it's the same as real steel measurements.

Originally Posted by ILLusion

I agree, re-heating it will be the best option, looking at how tight the trigger guard appears.

I have worn it in and lightly heated it. I do not have the aforementioned issues anymore.

Originally Posted by NVC

Shadownet the only way you can fix your holster retention is by re-heating it with a heat gun. On your pictures I can see shiny spots on the kydex. That is a sign that the kydex has been overheated and is too hot. So take care and don't spot heat in one place too long and keep it moving. Also don't heat areas that you dont need or you will lose the shape/form of you holster. Also use a proper ridge duty with these type of kydex form fitted holsters which will help with the holster being pulled up during your draw and also prevent the holster from swaying side to side. Another tip is when you weave you belt through the holster also weave it through the belt loop of your pants in the middle of the two belt loops of the holster. If you dont understand I can post a pic for you.

Thanks for the tips, I think I get what you mean.

[spartan117]

Originally Posted by ILLusion

My first line / concealed carry setup now:
Kimber Warrior with Streamlight TLR-2, "MD Cut"


Staggered placement allows reduced restriction when accessing the magazines (compared to if the magazines were stacked on top of each other.)

The quad mag carrier can be separated to create two individual double mag carriers for an ultra low profile concealed carry setup.

You were right Brian. The finish on the 1911 does hold up pretty well.