POLL: MG36 as acceptable lmg yay or nay?

[Colin_S]

My criteria is easy.

Is the weapon in question in use or was it in use by any military in the world? The MG36 was not, only had a short production lifetime and has been discontinued. I ran one for a year many years back, I loved it but yeah I felt it was like cheating compared to people running M249/M60s so I stopped and got rid of it.

M27 IAR is not a LMG and it wasn't designed to use a beta C mag.

To each their own though...

[Long_Bong]

Originally Posted by Colin_S

My criteria is easy.

Is the weapon in question in use or was it in use by any military in the world? The MG36 was not, only had a short production lifetime and has been discontinued. I ran one for a year many years back, I loved it but yeah I felt it was like cheating compared to people running M249/M60s so I stopped and got rid of it.

M27 IAR is not a LMG and it wasn't designed to use a beta C mag.

To each their own though...

I do respect the rational here, but applying this rule would drasticaly reduce the weapons availables in game for player

[lurkingknight]

Originally Posted by Colin_S

My criteria is easy.

Is the weapon in question in use or was it in use by any military in the world? The MG36 was not, only had a short production lifetime and has been discontinued. I ran one for a year many years back, I loved it but yeah I felt it was like cheating compared to people running M249/M60s so I stopped and got rid of it.

M27 IAR is not a LMG and it wasn't designed to use a beta C mag.

To each their own though...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M27_IAR

Design

The M27 is based on the Heckler & Koch HK416, which in turn derives from the M4 carbine and Heckler & Koch G36.[16] It features a gas-operated short-stroke piston action (instead of the traditional direct impingement) with a rotating bolt. It is modified with a heavier barrel and includes a bayonet lug. The free-floating barrel is surrounded by MIL-STD-1913 Picatinny rails for use with accessories and optics. It draws ammunition from a standard 30 round STANAG magazine. Due to its role, high capacity magazines of between 50 and 100 rounds are being explored.[11] The M27 has been successfully test fired with the Armatac SAW-MAG 150 round drum magazine.[17] The M27 cannot be fed from the widely used PMAG 30 GEN M2 magazine that M4s or M16 rifles in the squad can take. However, the newer PMAG 30 GEN M3 and the EMAG were designed to be compatible with the IAR. The IAR will be distributed one per four-man team, three per squad, and 28 per company, with 4,476 total for the Marine Corps. Nine M249s will still be available per company in reserve. The standard optic is the Trijicon ACOG SAW Day Optic. The gas-piston operating system makes the system very reliable, while the SAW has problems with jamming. It is said that in the amount of time it takes to clear the typical jam on a SAW, a Marine can clear a jam on the IAR and fire another 30-round magazine.[11]

IF you showed up to afghanistan in 2002 with a handful of IARs with drum mags and said to a bunch of saw gunners which they'd rather have, I think you'd have a quick answer.

Who doesn't want a lighter weight, more accurate platform that can do the same thing?


but that's neither here nor there, this is airsoft. There's no need to change out barrels or clear jams... only to shoot bitches.

[Colin_S]

Originally Posted by Long_Bong

I do respect the rational here, but applying this rule would drasticaly reduce the weapons availables in game for player

Ya this is airsoft, run what you want at a skirmish and clear any questionable guns with the game host first before showing up. I have to admit, I loved the "dual role" myself and when I ran into hosts that said no to the MG36 I just used mid cap mags which isn't as big a liability frankly.

[Colin_S]

Originally Posted by lurkingknight

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M27_IAR




IF you showed up to iraq in 2002 with a handful of IARs with drum mags and said to a bunch of saw gunners which they'd rather have, I think you'd have a quick answer.

Who doesn't want a lighter weight, more accurate platform that can do the same thing?


but that's neither here nor there, this is airsoft. There's no need to change out barrels or clear jams... only to shoot bitches.

This is airsoft, no need to bring Iraq or anything into this, it's totally irrelevant to the subject matter.

As per your Wiki link, I don't see where they say C mags are standard issue, they're being explored.

[Long_Bong]

The new double stack 60 rounds surefire mags will somewhat chage a lot of perspective.

[Gato]

Originally Posted by Colin_S

My criteria is easy.

Is the weapon in question in use or was it in use by any military in the world? The MG36 was not, only had a short production lifetime and has been discontinued. I ran one for a year many years back, I loved it but yeah I felt it was like cheating compared to people running M249/M60s so I stopped and got rid of it.

M27 IAR is not a LMG and it wasn't designed to use a beta C mag.

To each their own though...

Going by that logic, weapons such as Masadas, and a number of other odd weapons and variants would be excluded from use at games.

That said, what you posted is statedly your opinion and I fully respect that as you're not trying to force it on other people. In an ideal world, I'd agree. In an ideal world, I'd also have an entire team at a game standardised and organized

As far as my opinion on this poll goes, yes, I'm fine with it so long as it's a proper MG36 and not just a random G36 series rifle with a beta mag. Same with the Colt LMG, I'd accept that as what it is, an LMG. An M16 with beta mag is not a colt LMG. RPK is the same thing, an LMG, an AK with drum mag is not :P.

So long as one has a true MG36, I don't think one will have any issues

[Colin_S]

Haha fair enough, though it really only applies to LMGs specifically since these weapons give its users an advantage in terms of amount of ammo carried and ready to fire. Personally I think this should be balance out with a negative (like a much heavier gun).

My opinion is formed by my personal experience with the MG36. I had a CA with a drum mag and bipod that was only heavier than a standard G36 because of the drum mag. After a while it just didn't feel fair please note though that these are my personal thoughts, I don't care if someone else runs one.

[lurkingknight]

Originally Posted by Colin_S

This is airsoft, no need to bring Iraq or anything into this, it's totally irrelevant to the subject matter.

As per your Wiki link, I don't see where they say C mags are standard issue, they're being explored.

I'm going to pick at your statements now, because this is what I don't get.


You will say that the mg36 is not admissible in airsoft because no real military force adopted it into use.

And then you turn around and say this is airsoft, and that real world testing of a weapon system using something that it wasn't designed for but being tested to use, is not admissible?

Which one is it going to be? You can't have both.

[Colin_S]

Originally Posted by lurkingknight

I'm going to pick at your statements now, because this is what I don't get.


You will say that the mg36 is not admissible in airsoft because no real military force adopted it into use.

And then you turn around and say this is airsoft, and that real world testing of a weapon system using something that it wasn't designed for but being tested to use, is not admissible?

Which one is it going to be? You can't have both.

That's a fair point. Still the drum mag is not standard equipment, perhaps it will be but it's not yet. You do see people running M4s with beta C mags in real life too yet those are not allowed at games.

[Long_Bong]

http://www.surefire.com/tactical-equ...magazines.html

M4 support anyone...

[Gato]

Originally Posted by Long_Bong

http://www.surefire.com/tactical-equ...magazines.html

M4 support anyone...

having handled those, if not something similar, but I think it was those, I'll tell you this, 30rd mags are substantially heavier than airsoft mags, THOSE fuckers can be used as a bludgeoning tool.

Also, forget going prone :P

[Danke]

This MG36 topic definitely seems a bit split personality.

You have a group that wants to use the most realistic fake guns with accurate gear in a team based environment with tactics and all the other "real" procedures.

But then you throw in the AEG in question which isn't a MG36. It's regular G36 with a part changed. Most opinion would be you might as well add a couple guys with aliens pulse rifles and a guy with a flintlock into the mix if you're going down that road.

This being airsoft you see MP5s with drum mags and Soviets carrying M4s and all the other individual choices so at the end of it the answer will have to be if it's OK with who you're playing against and OK with your team then it's OK.

That's a double edged sword of course because if you give this a mulligan then the opposing team may decide to run something you don't like.

[lurkingknight]

Originally Posted by Colin_S

That's a fair point. Still the drum mag is not standard equipment, perhaps it will be but it's not yet. You do see people running M4s with beta C mags in real life too yet those are not allowed at games.

sure. It's not standard issue kit.

What about pmc? They can use whatever the hell they want as long as it works for them. They can grab a standard m4 and put whatever mag they think will work best in their task.

You're approaching this from a rigid military issue perspective. If we play by your definitions, we'd all be using m4s with stanags with m249s that oorah, semper fi, yes sir, no sir, have standard issue kit and everything. Not saying you force it upon us, but that's the direction you're arguing from.

The thread isn't arguing about sticking a giant mag onto a rifle, it's arguing that weapons designed to be support weapons should be allowed to be used as such, as long as they look/feel the part, real life military usage aside. If it's airsoft, and at some point it was made to be used in prototype or in practice to fill a role, we should be able to have some fun with it.

Of course, the day people start carrying phaser rifles around, I'm out. There are some really silly roundabout arguments being used to deter the usage of these light weight platforms designed to be support weapons.

It's pretty clear though, if it's a g36c with a betamag, it doesn't classify it as a mg36. If it's a 416d with a betamag, it's not a m27.

RPK is excluded from this since there's an actual rpk you can buy, but obviously you can't stick a drum on an AK and call it RPK.

It's clear what this thread is asking for in terms of clarification between a rifle and a support weapon.

[Colin_S]

Yes I accept it's the direction I'm arguing from. From a skirmisher perspective it doesn't matter what the gun is, let's go and have some fun. From a mil simmer perspective though the MG36 gun configuration might not be allowed, which is a valid point to bring up.

I have over 20 guns, one for anything I want to do (hmm I'm missing WW2 now that I think of it) so for me it's not a big deal. I don't know what type of games CR0M plays so I posted to give him my thoughts (which he asked for) from a rigid perspective so that he's aware of the potential pitfalls of getting building a MG36.

When I ran the MG36 there have been times I've been told flat out that a drum mag is not acceptable. Didn't bother me one bit, I understand and agree (now) and feel that anyone who plays airsoft and wants to get a MG36 should know before spending the money.