Why you don't wear Military Insignia you haven't earned..
 

Or at the very least why you shouldn't post pics of yourself wearing them
online

Another lost soul who'd have been saved by a quick set of SAS sunglasses.

Lerch is a well known around here and he is just headed to training.

He never represented himself as BEING what he wears. So what the fuck are you talking about?

I can't stand airsofters that itch about this stuff then drool all over pics of themselves posted on this site.

It's called re-enactment. Grow the fuck up.

what am I talking about?

I never said he was posing to be anything; he just wears all the insignia, etc. Also, I didn't write the article, just saw it on militaryphotos.net

Your tag line suggests you at least agree with the article.

They seem to have a pretty poor opinion of airsoft on that site, period. I wonder why they need to find a Canadian airsofter to bash when they've got so many of their own to choose from.

tag line? the thread title?


Well, whats wrong with it? Lerch posted lots of pics of himself wearing British Army Regimental Insignia, etc on militaryphotos.net an yea this is what happened.


As for the matter of him wearing, it, yea I agree that he shouldn't, especially the berets, capbadges, etc

They only really bash those who wear insignia. An Lerch isn't the only person to get bashed there. Lots of others from America an Europe an been shit on for wearing insignia, etc. Especially the Polish Airsofters who dressed up in full USMC uniform an went to an airport, flew in the uniform, etc Oh an the Polish dude(part of the before mentioned group) who got a US Airborne tattoo was bashed an rightly so.

Some guys have been reported to the authorities too. But they were more of the "poser/walt" crowd.

I'm not currently in the military but I do recall more than a small amount of pride in your regiment your cap badge & the colour of your beret. Some folks put a lot of weight behind the uniform they have earned.

Running across the wrong people on the best day of their life whilst in their regalia would not result in compliments.

And as a side not I would not take a whiff, or a hint or even an idea of any of the kit you've acquired or customized on a recruit training course! That's for anyone, not just the current target.

what's your point?

so what if the man wants to wear military insignia?

im not a member of a swat team and I have a vest with a SWAT patch on it, so I'm a poser?

dont bring that shit in here.

+1

i wear my grandfathers tags from korea all the time should i start looking over my shoulder?

I was referring to ARRSE, not Militaryphotos. Read ARRSE's airsoft page to see what I mean.

And yet, people were complaining about taht guy stealing photo credits and pretending to be a Navy SEAL.

Well I disagree with you.

As long as he is not attempting to pass himself off as trained and capable, it's just another form of compliment, in the form of mimicry.

I agree those who tell tall tales and talk bullshit are way over the line, but there is a difference that most folks choose not to see.

he was pretending to BE part of the seals and claiming things other people did as well as photos

lerch plays dressup

a slight difference

Precisely, but you can't tell that from looking at a picture of a person, so it's wrong to judge someone like that

I'm not saying I agree, however, I'm just saying people should understand why the real people are angry about things like this.

You are pretending to be something when you wear insignia. Yea, I know it's a lot different than the guy who's actually saying he is a Soldier, or whatever.


Reenacting/Living History the past, ie WW2, Vietnam, etc IMO is fine. With the exception to some reenactors who wear medals for valor, etc.


Making yourself out to be a modern soldier, etc an wearing Combat Patches, CIBs, Jump Wings, etc Not a fan of. You can look like whatever you want without the insignia.

I can't belive Lerch isn't in this thread yet!

Come the summer contact the Admins of that site with some pictures of you having a miserable time in training. If the Brits have anything it's a sense of humor so I bet they'll tag on an update to that entry.

I have to agree with you somewhat...I don't wear the ones I earned let alone the ones I didn't. But I don't get my knickers in a twist because some guy wants to immerse him/herself into a character. Dressing up is dressing up and Lerch never tried to portray himself as anything other than a Brit Fanboy. Kinda harsh treatment IMHO.

The cost of wearing Insignia
 

You have not earned is to be called out as a Poser by the people who have earned them. The extreem end of such action could be getting knocked around by them.

As long as you are clear that what you are doing is "an impression" a costume and you don't have an issue with being labled a "wanabee" There is no offense.

Imitation is the purest form of flattery. Out of all the units of the world the wanabees, wannabe your unit. That has to count for something, no?

Oh yea, I agree it is a bit much what they did to him. But he took the risk, especially with the site he posted pics on. I more or less posted this so people know that yea; some people get pissed off/insulted when they see people wearing insignia they haven't earned.

Because they can't distinguish the difference between imitation as a form of flattery, and outright mis-representation and lying?

Pieces of fabric don't make for an illustrious unit or membership in said unit, that honour is earned. If you've earned it, it's there whether you're buck naked or decked out for ceremonies. The idea of belonging to that special group shouldn't be so flimsy that the first person who offers to honour you through imitation is lynched. If only hockey players sued every fan that wore their special number.

That being said, one should show respect for those they wish to imitate by moderating the degree of imitation. I seem to recall a particular sensitivity over that maroon berret.

Wearing shirts, etc with a sports team or a company name is a lot different than military.

Sports clothing, etc is put out for
a.) money
b.) advertising
c.) support the team


Military insignia, etc is only for those that have earned it.

Want to show support, wear a support the troops t-shirt.



There is a lot of pride for the people who have earned those patches, etc Some have died earning them(ie combat patchs, CIBs).

I agree, the guy did nothing wrong by dressing up. This is a form of idolization and it should be appreciated. And yes, your title implies that the guy did something wrong. First thought, "Oh, great! someone got shot", and then I read the post.

SO WHAT! Are you going to live your life walking on eggshells worrying about what everyone thinks. The guys uniform kicks ass. There, one more for his side. Elitism is everywhere, even the military.

I'm sooo not into milsim and I've even gotten into it with a few of the milsim guys on ASC for disagreeing that milsim is the best form of airsoft and whatnot,

but I dont think that anyone has the right to tell them that they cannot do what they like, especially when they are doing it as accurately and authentically as possible, I think it shows a level of respect IMO

I don't see any outrage in the article... it really is kinda just poking fun at him..

On other sites I've seen guys get pissed off over people wearing unearned insignia.

Where is line drawn, though? If it's the issue of soldiers dying, most soldiers fight and die wearing their country's military camo, would that preclude everyone else from wearing that pattern? Because one could easily make the argument that you'd need to earn that right, too, that the camo pattern was made for the soldiers to fight in, not a fashion statement.

Wearing camo is completly different than wearing something like a Ranger Tab or CIB.


AFAIK no one cares if people wear a uniform, its just the insignia that people get mad over.

would anyone be surprised if he did?:rolleyes:

well i know that its ellegal for civi's to own or have real arm forces camo in thier posetion.as for the badges and stuff , if its just a game or a movie i personally find it ok.i LOVEE Stargate SG-1 and ive gone outta my way to dress and have the whole bit. my friends and i make our own movies and we have a whole CG( computer graphics artist ) crew who makes all our effect ( exsplosions and stuff) for us, and its quite fun. :-)

Lets face it guys airsoft is just modern LARPing with a little less gay.

airsoft: Dress up as a soldier, insurgent, angry civi, zombie, secret agent, ect. Wear combat boots and tac vests. Go out into a mock up battle field and shoot tiny plastic balls at each other.

LARP: Dress up as a Knight, orc, wizard, zombie, ninja, ect. Wear a replica armor and breastplates. Go into a mock fantasy setting and hit each other with plastic swords.

Ok sure so the diffrence is airsofters role play somthing that exists, but that really shouldnt matter, it is just playing a role and having some fun. A way to escape the norm. I mean I am in the CF but I prefere to play as a civie or some other role because cadpat and milsim (well not sim) IS the norm for me therefore I want somthing diffrent. Same for anyone not in a military who plays the role of somone who is. Just dont walk around in public in a uniform that you shouldnt be wearing.

lightening bolt lightening bolt.


Pretty harsh, when I was reading that I thought it was a joke as in a Ha Ha deal; then I got to the insults of him wearing desert gear because he's here in Canada and now I'm royally pissed. What's wrong with Canadian enlisted or not wearing desert patterns? I mean what's that say about Canada's involvement in the Middle East? Shouldn't be allowed to wear Desert cause they're from Canada?! Give me a break.

The entire take down of Lerch is ridiculous and overzealous. Funny that its posted just after he gets confirmed orders for his BMQ enrollment.

I obviously have no problem with wearing some camo uniform you bought and adding some patches you bought. This is a game/simulation/whatever.

The problem is when you upload pictures of yourself doing such to MILITARYPHOTOS.NET, not "MILSIMPHOTOS.NET" or whatever. (If he actually did upload them himself, he brought it on himself.)

I agree with Max but there is a point to draw the line. I think slip-ons and equivalent trade/unit markings are too much. That little tab on the bottom of slip-ons or that shoulder flash saying your unit is a bit too much for airsoft in my opinion. People work hard for their trade and often have a strong bond with their unit like a brother hood. So if your pretending to be part of that brother hood when your not I can see how it's offensive.

I know, I know, I should have said "PLUS FOUR
", and not "LEVEL FOUR".

Brits that haven't been to Wainwright may not know about our vast Canadian deserts (heck people in Ontario don't even know{or even our delicious desserts}) but you never know, they could be familiar with the terrain around Abbotsford and know there isn't a hint of cactus there short of a garden center.

I wear badges, on my nam uniform and I intend to wear them on my MC, did I earn them no. Do I fucking admire the people that do earn them and fight for us etc HELL YES I DO! If I can give them praise by wearing their unit badge then I'm going to. Learch got lynched unfairly for sporting Brit badges. And militaryphotos.net has a lot of arm chair commandos too, so their self-righteous bullshit doesn't fly half the time, the ones on mil photos who serve, AWESOME! If they wanna get pissed off then obviously they don't know flattery when they see it.

Its simple, if it is worn with the intent to mislead someone into believing that the said rank/medals/insignia were earned when they were not, I agree, its improper, as is wearing your re-enactment uniform in a place like a plane - there is no valid reason to be wearing it there other than to do just that.

However, re-enactment and military simulation has a long and respectable history going back to the civil war and earlier. Re-enactors play an important role in maintaining public awareness and help keep alive valuable history. A re-enactor goes to great lengths to ensure his/her re-enactment is an accurate portrayal, even going as far as to consult veterans or historical references to get the look and persona correct.

Warriors in the modern era that would accept re-enactors of past conflicts and nations sometimes forget that their own period is just as valid to re-enact as a past one, and in many cases, is just as important to remember and maintain. The vast majority of re-enactors usually revere those they are portraying and have more respect for those they are 'playing' than I think many give credit for. I attribute that to a simple lack of understanding of the motives and purposes by those who see it today.

Airsoft is cannon fodder for a lot of groups like real gun hobbiests, as well as serving members of the military and police services. I've been on the recieving end of that negative response on many occassions and thankfully I am articulate enough to explain it, in detail, and in many cases make new friends who respect why I do it and are subsequently honored by it. There are the few that will always just chalk it up to posing, and well, thats the wonderful thing about a free country - the right to disagree.

Anyone who sees life in the framework of 'absolutes' with no areas of gray or compromise are just socially and mentally inflexible. I don't spend much time trying to change someone who operates like that as its pretty much a waste of time because they lack the capacity or empathy to extend themselves to another point of view. -MikeL- 's posts are precisely that and I wouldn't spend another minute debating it with him, or anyone else on that other board. Move on to something productive.

Do the Stargate fanboys freak out if they see an airsofter wearing SGC patches?

Personally I grew out of wearing rank and unit patches a long time ago, except of course for my 'Nam getup, which is more of a reenactment kit than an airsofting kit.

The same thing can be said by the extremists about say, camo patterns... Example "Fuck a duck, you're not a marine, why are you wearing MARPAT?" etc etc.

It's a never ending circle.

And may god help the poor soul who gets jump wings tattooed on him without actually earning his jump wings.

100% agree with MikeL, and I'll leave it at that.

People with a jump tattoo who arnt jumpers is just wrong. I mean sure pretend all you want get a patch wear it while you LARP (:P) but a freakin tattoo?

some people are way too materialistic...

oh snap this could go bad

it could, but people could just ignore my post and go on with their daily routine.

I don't mind people wearing patchs they did not earn as long as they are not pretending to be for a gain.

I'm not very fond of the attitude some soldiers have about their stuff and how we must respect this and that about them. We all have a job to do, we all make sacrifices in order to get it done. No one is better than the other. As long as we respect each other, it's all good IMO.

respect +1

To be fair, he posted his photos on the Reenactment / Airsoft / Paintball forum of militaryphotos.net. It's not like if he was posing as a British soldier elsewhere.

That website if full of attitude and misplaced testosterone. The reenacment part is just a feeding ground for those "real soldier power" guys that know it all.

What about actors in movies??? Should they not wear the patches or insigs of those they are portraying? They never earned them, does that mean we should burn every war movie ever made? As long as your not going around telling people that your something your not i dont see the issue. The tattoo this is a little to extreme but gee patch?? Dont people have something better to get their panties in a bunch over?

A uniform is a physical manifestation of the membership into your unit. It distinguishes you and places you in line with all other past/present members of that unit. This includes trade badges, coloured berets, etc. I for one think the right to wear the aforementioned must be earned, and not be worn just to go around playing army. In some courses, it is an extremely hard endeavor to accomplish, and I can see where someone wearing their badges can become agitated. Furthermore, In the CF(and probably as well in the British Army), the cap brass is what you salute 'from' and should not be taken lightly.

Let me turn this discussion on it's head. What is the big deal in not having a 'perfect' uniform setup and just playing with team badges, or even made up names? Why is it that you MUST have those Royal Marines Commandos and Airborne Tabs?

Why are we using replica weapon and not generic plastic boxes that shoot BBs?

How can you compare a C7 to a PPCLI cap badge? C'mon.

I dont use any badges or patches on my bdu and i dont feel naked. I dont see the point of getting a real unit one unless its for reenactment. Also i understand military servicemens point about the honnor and sacrifice they made to get their real one.
I plan to have one made in memory of hellranger (like my avatar) and maybe get some name tapes.

i disagree with that article. the people on that end should be flattered (for lack of a better word) that someone tries to emulate them as such. maybe fire them a link to wannabe.com ive never seen lerch clain to be anything hes not, but he puts a lot of time and research into his kits

edit*
i didnt realise he flaunted specific patches and posted pics of himself on a real deal website. if thats true than yes those people have everty right to be concerned.

militaryphotos is anal about people who aren't in the forces wearing armed forces insignias.
The majority of airsofters are not, as we understand it's just part of the game.
Let's just leave it at that lol

Since Sturmer mentioned it, I'm kinda wondering the same thing.


Why do people feel the need that they have to have these patches? Would you still not look like a Soldier, or whatever look you're going for without them?

And, some people say they do it because they respect the real troops, etc but, if wearing the insignia pisses off real soldiers isn't that kinda defeating the point?


Also, would any of you wear a Police Badge for a game?

I agree with Mike/Sturmur.

You DON'T need patches, and shit to have fun.

And really, there's no need for cloning a SOF soldier, or any other soldiers credentials for a game, unless, ofcourse it's some sort of reenactment.

I know Lerch personally from when I was OJTing his division at HMCS Quadra and I know that he in no way shape or form would try to pass himself off as anything he is not. Though he was drooling over joining the CF at that time. Sheer, sorry for the bad luck. Just another showing of how some people have no life other than picking people apart on the net to make themselves look better.

Why should battle reenacting be limited to battles 20 years +? How are modern day military tabs/wings/patches any different then say a ww2 ones? They didnt mean as much back then as they do now?

Seeing as he had posted his pics in a reenactment/airsoft forum I don't see how the people that wrote that page could be so pig-headed.

I'd like to precede that I have read many of Lerch's posts and even though I haven't met him think he is a good guy and I mean him no harm on his reputation. I think with his military training in BMQ, SQ, etc, he will see his mistakes.

In my opinion, I think no military patches should be used on any uniforms. Unless, you are reenacting a specific battle with a specific outcome then it would be fine. Airsofters are trying to mimic specific groups of different countries who have gone or are going into battle that have earned their badges through hard work and discipline. I don't mean to sound like a military elitist, but earning badges you haven't put your blood, sweat and tears into is disrespectful to the ones who have.

The question is, is he reenacting specific battles or is he trying to mimic the regiment is that he is wearing. I believe that the moniker of "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" does not work in the military sense. Again, I am not trying to sound like a military douchebag but having earned a badge in my "unit" has shown me that the badges that have come up in this discussion should not be degenerated into some materialistic squabble.

The soldiers who have earned their trade specific badges should be revered, not through imitation, but through the refusal of wearing said badges.

2 cents
 

It is not any different it is simply in the way you personally view airsoft. But this is like an abortion discussion, the mid ground discuss and the extremes will never change.

I have a wee bit different opinion to Sturmur, trade badges don't mean much beyond the learning the skills required to acquire that badge. Rank insigna is pretty much the same thing, all armies use some form, a great many as is ours, is based on the British system. If a an airsoft group wants to use them to define the chain of command more power to them.

As for the colour of a beret it is a like trade or rank identifier, it simply indicates your basic skill set, maroon for airborne, black for armoured etc. Now some brit units and us special forces use the beret a little differently but in and of itself it has no great meaning.

And yes I did my time and earned the rank and trades qualifications, to make the comments above.

Unit specific identifiers , such as cap badges and shoulder flashes are tricky. Mostly because for a lot of people it is an emotional issue. But as others have pointed out if it is ok for re-enactors then it is ok for airsoft. Would I want an airsoft guy wearing my regimental cap badge and a black beret in game, not really. But if someone did I would expect the same level of detail Lerch puts into his kit or off with it.

And really that is what this should be about did he make an effort to make it as correct as possible. I have played with him,and figure he made a solid effort, so correct his mistake so the kit is right and move on.

I don't consider it bad luck, hell, it makes for a good laugh :D

For the rest of you, whether you're against the wearing, for the wearing, or frankly don't give two shits, carry on. I can't believe how much chit chat there's been on the subject since the blokes on ARRSE picked up some old pictures of me :P

Technically, under the Criminal Code, it's also illegal:

Mate, it's not because it was picked up by ARRSE but it's the principle behind it.

i have an evil monkey (family guy) patch that i'm planning to put them on my M84 Camo... is that a sin??

419. Every one who without lawful authority, the proof of which lies on him,

(a) wears a uniform of the Canadian Forces or any other naval, army or air force or a uniform that is so similar to the uniform of any of those forces that it is likely to be mistaken therefor,

(b) wears a distinctive mark relating to wounds received or service performed in war, or a military medal, ribbon, badge, chevron or any decoration or order that is awarded for war services, or any imitation thereof, or any mark or device or thing that is likely to be mistaken for any such mark, medal, ribbon, badge, chevron, decoration or order,

Now, would this not also include re-enactors? what about pers in an airsoft game that use an issued pattern with matching kit? (even if obtained in the civilian market, and possibly close knockoff?)

i realize that this may be taking the regs far too literal, but if the issue is based on principle...

The blog has an update.

See Brits do have a sense of humor, of course they could be fishing you in for a larger "beasting" but it'll be fun to watch either way.

Ridiculous argument. People need to look past themselves. As long as he's not hurting anyone then so be it. He's reenacting with the best of intentions, never made any false claims. Why tread on his toes, there's really no point in calling him out for nothing. Thread should be locked and binned, especially since is concerns a member of these boards.

You misinterpret what I meant, the amount of threads that came out in the past week is what I referred to, not the discussion itself (which has been dogged on MP.net for awhile now).

How about people do what they want (as long its not illegal) and others mind their own business and worry about themselves?

Lerch awesome stuff.

Edit: Wearing a uniform in public is different that on a private airsoft field.

if i was lerch id feel FAMOUS...

There are some things that are simply not worth explaining to someone who is unwilling to listen or understand. Move along.

A good bit of the "real" photos on that site are fucking airsoft anyway... :D

It's the intent. Not the patch itself, but what you are trying to add or take away from it and what it represents.

I don't wear actual unit patches on my airsoft stuff because I don't re-enact but I would/will if I do a Vietnam game in the future.

While I'm not a fan of wearing rank/real patches/etc, not only for the "you didn't earn it" aspect but mostly because I find it overly poser-ish, I do have to ask everyone up in arms about: if those ribbons and trinkets are so unfathomably important why do people who earned them readily pawn them off for $3.50+shipping on eBay? Been to an Army Surplus store lately? I could make myself into a war -decorated general of just about any army for around $50.

Secondly, this massively condescending and frankly pathetic article, purportedly written by a member of the military (the author lacked sufficient gonads to actually claim credit for his essay) does little but cast members of the armed forces everywhere in a bad light: on or off the internet, words and actions of individual soldiers reflect on the forces they serve. This bloke basically showed the world that the major difference between an airsofter and a British soldier is that soldiers are Internet Bullies who'll pick on kids half way around the world. Very mature. Very classy. Big thumbs up.

Because yes, by the same token that site makes blanket derisive statements about airsofters, I can make a blanket observation about soldiers. (oh and I KNOW someone's all riled up reading this and about to quote it for a flaming reply, and to that person I say: BOO-fuckin-HOO. Get a grip, you douche, and try to apply a bit of Reading Comprehension skills here.)

No, I don't agree with wearing patches you didn't earn. But I agree even less with that article and that whole site, which to me wreaks of thuggery.

Modern Day Larping with a little less gay
 

Hehehe

I hate RP in airsoft it makes me feel retarded :(
although sometimes it can add some serious fun to the game...

LMFAO now if only I could find a picture of that very same guy but in LARP gear.

I like the RP aspect in airsoft, I find it gets you more into it. Even if its just a simple skrim its nice to have a clear cut scenario of whats going on and whos who. Next game I call airsoft wizard. I will buy a large bag of yellow BBs and throw them at people. And wear a kilt.

YOU CAN'T WEAR A KILT UNLESS YOU ARE SCOTTISH. IT OFFENDS MY ANCESTORS!

:-)

Im irish, we wear kilts as well. In fact I wore one last wedding I went to. Cept we have a solid color kilt. None of that plaid stuff :P

If your brave enough to wear a kilt to an airsoft game, by all means go ahead. Just please don't be hurdling over logs or climbing ladders, or you might end up-well you know. Squating down on one knee to shoot would be disturbing to your foe, as well as asking for trouble!

Well said.

I remember a case in our airsoft group a few years ago where someone showed up with a unit badge on a hat and almost had his head removed by a member of the forces. Personally, I can't agree more with not wearing an insignia you didn't earn. That being said, I'm not about to tell anyone they can't or shouldn't do it because thats not my place. but if some member of the unit or military calls you out on it, it is well within their right to do so. Wearing a camo set is one thing but to actually have the insignia of a unit on your kit that you did not earn is simply a dishonour to the unit no matter who you are. It's not like the actual men in the unit just signed up and got the badge, they probably went through hell and back to get the honour of wearing it.

So I can see why they would write an article like this and be a bit upset, they have every right to be. On the other hand as was mentioned above, some forces people obviously don’t have the same pride in their badge/unit and pawn it off. In any case, if you choose to wear a badge on your kit be ready for someone to take a strip off you and that is their right as long as they are actually in the forces. Personally i don’t play airsoft to look the part, I play because I enjoy the sport aspect and I couldn’t give a rats ass what I look like. My kit is purchased on the bases of giving me a competitive edge in this sport and nothing more.

I wear an old surplus CF Helo pilot jacket at night and when it's chilly, no patches or flashes. Why? It's a nice fucking coat, keeps me warm, and looks cool. Do I strut around pretending I'm in the CF? Nope. When asked if I've served, or what unit I'm in, I tell people it's a surplus jacket and I haven't enlisted. Personally I don't wear any real life patches on my airsoft kit. I've got a subdued Canadian flag patch on my jacket, but that's it.

If someone shows up at a game wearing unit patches and is all decked out to the nines in issue gear/real patches I can see wear a serving/former member might take issue, but as I've never served, can I take issue with someone shows up like this? Not that I really do so much... but still. Is it right for someone who hasn't earned a patch, to complain about someone else who is wearing a patch he too hasn't earned?

So I can see where both sides are coming from (and add a third). People can assume that someone wearing a surplus piece of uniform, or a unit patch, is a serving or former member, which can/does offend certain people.

But like a gun, the image can be worn two ways. People can put it on with the intent to decieve and pretend (akin to using the gun to kill) or they can put it on to honour and pay tribute (and look cool I suppose... akin to using the gun to defend).

Plus... Lerch is cool shit. He sold me a wicked TM1911, so I think I'll let it slide :D

You know, this can all be avoided by getting your own patches made up... :P

Nothing wrong with wearing the flag. Soldiers don't have a monopoly on patriotism.

the arguing is complete bs...wear what u want, i dont see the point of wearing any "official" badges, but if it is your will be my guest

i vote for who the fuck cares... its your money and enjoyment...if they want you to take it of do a pistols duel to see if it should come off...

Its taken me a while to read all this, but at the end I'm still confused as to my own verdict. SOme things fly with me and others dont, those that dont would not allow me to fly off the handle, but certainly if the accused was telling tales about what ever it was, then a casual reminder might be in order. Unit badges are fine, even ones depicting yourself as a navy seal, or Delta Force, because we know (or at least assume) That you are not a member of the Special forces and have time for Airsoft. I have to say that seeing people with Ranger Tabs, CSOR, or Jump wings/ Maroon Beret does get me ruffled inside. Most times the patch isn't worn properly, which if you were trying to honor someone by wearing it, you are succeeding in certainly not honoring it and opening yourself to scrutiny. Some courses, Jump course, and Ranger course are extremely hard even for those in the forces and may be a career long goal, so it is hard to say whether a ranger 'has' to be ok with someone wearing it.. That being said Nothing someone wears should open them to verbal abuse, or worse. That is not to say that you are not allowed to disagree with what they are wearing. Personally I do not like those who pretend to jump. But I wont attack them, just not fully asppreciate their efforts perhaps. Its tough to decide if you will be offended by someone wearing something or not, but it should certainly not lead to verbal abuse. As a member of the CF I know some guys who will hate imitator's, and the older guys you cant help but understand why, but for the younger generation, we should be more civil about it, but certainly do not have to like what some people do or wear.

FYI, the US Army are the only ones who wear unit insignia on their uniforms(them an Air Crew in the other services have Sqn patches on their flight suits).

That TRIDENT(SEAL badge) isn't a unit patch, it's a qualication badge, much like a Ranger or Special Forces tab or Airborne Wings.


If you want to know what the guys who have earned those badges feel about non qualified people wearing them head on over to SOCNET or armyranger.com and ask. Same with wearing SSI (unit/combat patches) - this is regardless if you are wearing a Ranger Scroll or 1st Infantry Division patch.

Still interested in getting a response for these questions.

same reason some people choose ACU over Marpat. They want to look the part.

Piss off real soldiers? Im no jumper/jtf/csor... but it does not piss me off at all. Lack of pride? Not at all. Get over it.

A police badge is a totally different thing. Your talking about an item that shows people that you would have peace officer status.

Again it goes back to the fact that he is an airsofter... on an airsoft field. He isnt going around downtown asking people for free coffee because hes a soldier.

Wow this is still going on.

Around here I actually don't even see that many people wearing official patches; those wearing patches are either team patches and/or various moral patches and other non-official stuff (Ghost Recon etc).

I can only speak from my own observations and opinions, but I'll take a stab at answering Mike's questions:


I think it's easy to get caught up in trying to get an impression "right." I do a lot of USMC stuff myself; I recently found myself getting hung up about shit like Coyote Brown actually being USMC Coyote 499 (or at least very close to it), and not Khaki, Tan, MJK or other color, when picking a vest. But THEN, I found a pic of a Force Recon dude wearing an MBSS that looked more like BHI's khaki-coyote (he was flanked by Marines wearing IBAs so it was a perfect reference).

So now BHI's not-so-Coyote-Brown (and similar counterparts) is an acceptable option to me.

Is this symptomatic of a form of mental illness? Maybe. I've been exposed to more than my fair share of Krylon fumes over the past decade. But point in case is it's easy to get really anal about little details. I can easily see how some people would think it's cool to nail the look perfectly, patches and all.

As I've mentioned before, I find it a bit too poser-ish and am uncomfortable wearing any sort of unit or rank. As for "Ranger", "Airborne", SF tabs, etc.. I think the media (movies, games, etc) have seriously made the value of that go down the toilet, so I can easily see how people now wouldn't think twice before slapping that on.




I'm not sure that a lot of people know it pisses off soldiers, from the start. I doubt most people who don't know see (or intend) any harm to it. Again, as mentioned before, you really don't need to look very far or have very deep pockets to get all this stuff. When I worked at the surplus I saw people do a half assed job of it every Halloween: Brit BDUs with a mix of US and Canadian patches and pins, or whatever, throw on a USN squadron patch for good measure cuz they look bad ass.

At least airsofters generally try to get it right. And if it was getting worn in public I could see them getting upset, but in the privacy of an airsoft game?




For SWAT style CQB? (I'm taking a stab in the dark here)

I suppose in the context of a milsim op, if a faction needed to be identified as the local police constabulary or something, then it serves a purpose.

But people just wearing it for shits and giggles, IMO falls into the same overly poser category as people wearing full unit and rank.

Have recently thought of this thread, even though I never followed it. Got a friend to grab me some woodland from (forget the base, is in upper New York) on his last trip there, and the BDU shirt I got has the flag on it, as well as US ARMY (I cut the Clarke nametape off and put my own on) an has the Mountain Rangers flash (10th I think) on the left shoulder with MOUNTAIN above it. Figured I'd leave them all on for the hell of it. No rank or anything else on it. I suppose it's "Not Cool" to do so, eh? Not that I care much, I'm not trying to pretend I'm anything, I just play the damned game as best I can.

Well, that's the debate at hand I suppose.

Flags and "US Army" aren't a problem to have on.

10th Mountain is the one some people would have an issue with, I suppose. But that begs the question, if it's such a precious patch, why is it being sold off to civvies like that? (if it was already sewn on to the BDUs, it most likely didn't cost any extra).

Is exactly that. I'm sure that's where the fine line is, I bought it like this, am not pretending to be a member by keeping it on. Then one has the "impression" aspect to deal with, someone else could have bought the BDU like that, thought "Hey, I'm going to do an impression of a 10th Mountain Ranger for airsoft" and add all the little bits and peices of gear to fill out that impression, maybe include a rank or something. Then it becomes more of an issue to those in this thread (and the thread regarding Lerch's uniform impressions).

Maybe I've been brainwashed by MP.net but the first thing I do now when I receive a uniform on wich there's patch/branch tape is to take them off. Why? I haven't been in the army, I haven't sweated my ass in basic to get the privilege to be called a soldier (ok just forget about my user name that was when I begun in airsoft...).

I have in the past as well, this time not gonna bother (even if the flag is the red, white, blue and yellow, which is gonna get me shot more). Part laziness, part "fuck it factor".

I'd have more of an issue with it being a Canadian Forces uniform with a patch though. Case in point, I have the squadren patch for the 403 Griffon Squadron at CFB Gagetown, I bought it when I spent a couple weeks there working with them. I also bought a couple CH-146 Griffon patchs, and the 50th anniversary patch for the Wolfpack Squadron. I put the Griffon patch and the Wolfpack patch on my work flight jacket, and another Griffon patch on my flightsuit, but not the 403 patch, because I wasn't a member of that squadron. I just put it on my office wall. I'm not a Griffon pilot, but have flown in them and have a few hours training in the CAE CH-146 Griffon simulator, but the biggest reason I wear the Griffon patch is that at that time I was working full time on our Bell 412, which is what the Griffon is.